Post by forestfalcon on May 5, 2009 22:44:03 GMT -5
It's my opinion, and I feel like I am entitled to it. Why do we stop hawking during the rabbit breeding season? Some of us feel as though it is ethically wrong to hunt pregnant does. I also have a problem with people that don't dispatch quarry with any kind of speed. I'm not a big fan of needless suffering. I feel the same way about this. People certainly don't need to agree with me, it's not going to hurt my feelings if they don't.
And Crbhawking, I do not agree with vivisection, either.
"We promised the world we'd tame it, what were we hoping for?" -Bloc Party
I could care less about how one hatches there quail. I have 85 three week old quail as it is. Tomorrow I stop turning the other 120 in the cooker. In three days I will add at least 80+ more into the equation. As I see my first batch grow, I enjoy most there health and absolute incredible development. Changing there water three times a day, and burning through pounds of food a day with so much that is wasted through the wire, the progress is phenomenal and well worth the pay off. As I see it, helping the weak from the egg, only brings the weak ones to age. Do your best with humidity in the cooker, especially at the end and let the strong ones survive. No help needed. My friends and I need some hawk food and furthermore, some good bacon wrapped quail casserole dinners. Yummy.
Joe
PS how many button quail do you need for a gravy quail casserole?
Geez, I wish I had room for production like that! I just got my order of 25 Bobwhite hatching eggs in the mail with the extra 10 making 35 and wondering how I'm gonna fit that into my set up! It took me 10 minutes just to rearrange my homemade incubator to make room for them! I'll help the weak ones hatch if it means another warm body for baggies or BC bait, but I'll never try to breed them. And button quail probably have about the same amount of meat as a sparrow, but then when I was flying kestrels I WAS half tempted to try making a dish of sparrow breast....just never got around to it... Ya just need to watch a few of those Andrew Zimmern's Bizarre Foods episodes and could probably get a few ideas...
Post by forestfalcon on May 6, 2009 7:05:41 GMT -5
Borderhawk, I can't say that I haven't thought the same thing. It would probably taste similar to squab (young pigeon,) which is very good. Although, by the time you tasted it, it would be gone...
"We promised the world we'd tame it, what were we hoping for?" -Bloc Party
I'm sorry, Killjoy, but actually suggesting that someone crack open a perfectly viable egg to satisfy curiosity is a bit irresponsible. It is no better that people backyard breeding dogs so that kids can experience the "miracle of life."
Human fetuses are pretty darn cramped inside the pregnant mother....what would you suggest here?
WOW!!!
yes i would suggest that EVERYONE find a pregnant woman, slit her throat and disect her to see the baby cramped.
that was a VERY irresponsible post FF. come on from you i did not expect that.
you know i had the second guy that hatched drown in about 1/8" of water, make you feel better? you know where that bird is? in the freezer with the ton of english sparrows i have dispatched this week. all of a sudden YOU have bad feelings about a bird dying that is going to get eaten?
please explain that to me?
and yes i showed my kids the dead bird in the egg, cause NOTHING lives forever.
jesus, do i need to worry about ticking packages for colorado now?
incase you dont realise it, that was a very immature statement on your part, i took a bad situation and made a learning situation out of it. and to turn me into some sort of maniac murderer is not cool.
would like to point out, i had one guy unable to hatch yesterday. he pecked for a while and after 3 hours of not being able to turn, i took great care and removed him from the egg. i figured 3 hours was a long time, as of 4 am he was still alive.
you know if you dont like me doing something, fine, but to compare what i did to a dead bird, to something a mental person would do for fun....... not cool.
Post by forestfalcon on May 6, 2009 8:02:56 GMT -5
wow. take a breath.
Let me put it more simply, since you've clearly gone off the reservation.
I give my birds baggies. I hinder them in a way that is not what I consider cruel (tethered, clipped primaries, etc.) My bird catches the baggie, I make in quickly and dispatch. Yes, the end of that bird's life is fearful, but not unnecessarily painful. I know of some falconers that will break the wing to hinder the baggie. This baggie, whatever it is, spends it's last moments in severe pain. It's not necessary.
Let me relate to what you are doing. I have quail in my freezer. Yes, I do have DOCs in my freezer. I have an assortment of other critters in my freezer. These animals died quickly. You are breeding quail for food. Fine. Nothing wrong with it. But when you remove the shell from a developing fetus, there is unnecessary discomfort involved. How long do you keep it alive like this before you "humanely" euthanize, and just so you can fulfill a passing fancy at what it looks like on the inside.
Killjoy, take a moment and think this over before you have another knee-jerk reaction reply.
"We promised the world we'd tame it, what were we hoping for?" -Bloc Party
Human fetuses are pretty darn cramped inside the pregnant mother....what would you suggest here?
look, after this its done. no rebuttle.
a statement like that deserves a knee jerk reaction. what would you want me to suggest?
i wanted to help people that might want to try this later. this is biology at its finest. you learn from craddle to grave, the life cycle of an animal, and sometimes the life cycle is short for some. I dont remeber what it was like in the womb, but i didnt have my head tucked under my arm on the way out, but i was a c-section, but my other 3 kids didnt either.
at least i took the time to learn something instead of just putting it to the side and freezing later. it was intresting and i would do it again. I dont have the big degree in biology, so this is how i learn. and how do you think THEY learned, by osmossis?
FYI, before i declared the one dead, i pumped his chest to see if it would start again, i cupped the body in my hands and blew into them to force air into his lungs, and the kids kept checking on him every hour to see if he was alive. this was after i pulled him from the egg and had a feeling he was dead.
anything else i should have done, difibulators maybe? didnt have them in his size.
so my knee jerk reaction was to the pregnant girls, and i think it was properly deserved. dont like the insuation that people should kill pregnant girls, and again, very shocked it came from a forum where people kill things for fun.
so if you have any more negative comments, please take them else where, cause they are not appreciated here.
Post by chad13dnvr (DBH) on May 6, 2009 11:49:23 GMT -5
PS how many button quail do you need for a gravy quail casserole?
About 40 will feed two hungry adults in a good casserole.
Another good solution for your non hatchers is two pickle them.
1)30/40 Quail embryos preferably still in the egg and almost done developing 2)Three parts apple cider vinegar 3)One part white vinegar 4)dried hot chili pepper (to taste) 5)One table sSpoon salt 6)One table sSpoon black pepper 7)15/20 whole peeled garlic cloves 8)any other hot spicy stuff you like to taste
Simmer all ingredients on the stove top for about 6 minuets on low heat. Can hot in a good mason canning jar and place in a cool dark place for two months. You can refrigerate if it makes you feel better.
When ready to eat place one embryo (don't worry the vinegar dissolves the shells) on a club cracker with a dollop of horseradish and a whole black or green olive and enjoy with an ice cold beer.
Some people grin and bear it, other people smile and change it.
Sounds like perfect beer food especially with the horseradish! I do plan on keeping some egg layers for quail omelettes and spicy pickled quail eggs. Yet another good beer food.
About 40 will feed two hungry adults in a good casserole.
  Can't you just wait until the hatch is over, and then break open the ones that didn't make it? I mean, if all you want is to see how they sit in the shell, there ought to be some that don't hatch that you can look at.
I'm sorry, Killjoy, but actually suggesting that someone crack open a perfectly viable egg to satisfy curiosity is a bit irresponsible. It is no better that people backyard breeding dogs so that kids can experience the "miracle of life."
Human fetuses are pretty darn cramped inside the pregnant mother....what would you suggest here?
WOW!!!
yes i would suggest that EVERYONE find a pregnant woman, slit her throat and disect her to see the baby cramped.
that was a VERY irresponsible post FF. come on from you i did not expect that.
you know i had the second guy that hatched drown in about 1/8" of water, make you feel better? you know where that bird is? in the freezer with the ton of english sparrows i have dispatched this week. all of a sudden YOU have bad feelings about a bird dying that is going to get eaten?
please explain that to me?
and yes i showed my kids the dead bird in the egg, cause NOTHING lives forever.
........ incase you dont realise it, that was a very immature statement on your part, i took a bad situation and made a learning situation out of it. and to turn me into some sort of maniac murderer is not cool.
........ you know if you dont like me doing something, fine, but to compare what i did to a dead bird, to something a mental person would do for fun....... not cool.
thanx for making me feel better!!
now its time for me to murder more living things.
i hope you eat salads the rest of your life!
Haha this is great. Yall would hate my biology classroom. All us kids learning from dead organisms. Wow that would be tragic.
" Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take, but as for me, GIVE ME LIBERTY OR GIVE ME DEATH" -Patrick Henry
l FYI, before i declared the one dead, i pumped his chest to see if it would start again, i cupped the body in my hands and blew into them to force air into his lungs, and the kids kept checking on him every hour to see if he was alive. this was after i pulled him from the egg and had a feeling he was dead.
I once asked a bird vet about CPR on a bird, and was told it was "like trying to refill a disposable Bic lighter." I was asking about an adult bird. He explained that because the heart is tucked away under the keel, it was pretty near impossible to get to it, without coming from under the keel, thus damaging the air sacs and lungs. It makes sense. Our hearts are under, somewhat, flexible ribs, but a bird's is under that hard, tough keel.
I will apologize for being somewhat over reactive. Personal ethics behind falconry, and hunting in general, are a touchy subject, and I can imagine that no two people think the same on all subjects. I should have PM'd you my concerns.
"We promised the world we'd tame it, what were we hoping for?" -Bloc Party
l FYI, before i declared the one dead, i pumped his chest to see if it would start again, i cupped the body in my hands and blew into them to force air into his lungs, and the kids kept checking on him every hour to see if he was alive. this was after i pulled him from the egg and had a feeling he was dead.
I once asked a bird vet about CPR on a bird, and was told it was "like trying to refill a disposable Bic lighter." I was asking about an adult bird. He explained that because the heart is tucked away under the keel, it was pretty near impossible to get to it, without coming from under the keel, thus damaging the air sacs and lungs. It makes sense. Our hearts are under, somewhat, flexible ribs, but a bird's is under that hard, tough keel.
I will apologize for being somewhat over reactive. Personal ethics behind falconry, and hunting in general, are a touchy subject, and I can imagine that no two people think the same on all subjects. I should have PM'd you my concerns.
no problem, i knew the bird was dead, but i just tried, its all i could do. i couldnt kill the bird any more than it already was.
so now i have 6 living subjects!!!
so excuse me while i go dispatch some sparrows..... unless FF has a problem with that!
Post by forestfalcon on May 11, 2009 18:42:58 GMT -5
What kind of substrate are you keeping them on? I have heard that if you keep them on something that doesn't have a whole lot of stability, they can end up splay legged. I think there is a whole website out there devoted to the pet keeping aspects of button quail... it should point you in the right direction of what you should be keeping them on.
"We promised the world we'd tame it, what were we hoping for?" -Bloc Party