Post by Master Yarak on Jan 15, 2007 21:30:49 GMT -5
Cjinx, Make no mistake we do exploit our birds. Falconry is a totally selfish sport. We intrude on the natural order of things. That is why we must excel in all aspects of bird care. Understanding there nature, there drives and motivations. Hunting is what raptors do with or without us. It is survival, it is a key element in there overall health. Our job is to make it easier for them to do just that, survive. Also you must understand that even though we are the dominate species we teach the birds to exploit us and our dogs. It is easy to get ahead of yourself but think about what you are trying to say BEFORE you post. Otherwise people will get the wrong message from your post and you will look very foolish. Yarak
If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away
oh sorry but does anyone know about Tx regs on taking the test before 14 then recieving your permits at 14.
From what I can tell it doesn't say but as you have to have a sponsor I think to take the test you might be hard pressed to find one that will be waiting on your birthday.
"ยง65.265 Permit Classes: Qualifications and Restrictions A person who is not a resident of this state may not hold any permit issued under this subchapter other than a nonresident trapping permit. (1)Apprentice class permittees. (A)Qualifications. An applicant for an apprentice falconry permit must: (i)be at least 14 years of age; (ii)have a sponsor at the general or master class during their apprenticeship; and (iii)have passed, with a minimum score of 80, a supervised, department administered falconry examination. "
So Iguess that is up to whoever is interpreting it. Sorry since that doesn't really help
Never settle.
"There's nothing like the feeling of knowing that you've made a difference in someone's life, even if that difference is a lifetime of nightmares and a fortune in therapy bills." - Marilyn Manson
Humans are a part of nature and therefor can do no evil in the eyes of nature. Skyscrapers, freeways, and yes Falconry is as natural as the rain.
Anyone that disagrees with this either doesn't understand the statement I'm trying to make or they arrogantly separate humans from nature just because of our higher brain functions.
Now I'm not saying that humans aren't a destructive force, I'm just speaking to the argument that "we(falconers) intrude on the natural order of things". We are a part of the natural order and no amount of murder, exploitation, creative thought, or any other action will change that. Everything we do is natural. It may not have a positive effect on other parts of nature but that doesn't mean we are outside of nature looking in.
Viruses kill, yet we don't look at them as being outside of nature or "evil" we merely see them as what they are, a dangerous facet of nature. It's time we all realized that we humans are merely a dangerous facet of nature; though in the long run we could never hurt the earth or nature. The worst thing that we could do is kill off the human race and restart the evolution with a mass extinction just like what happened with the dinosaurs.
Cheers! ;D
Last Edit: Jan 16, 2007 14:22:46 GMT -5 by snafu918
"The harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph." -Thomas Paine
"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? -Marianne Williamson
Post by Master Yarak on Jan 16, 2007 15:20:13 GMT -5
Snafu, Your point is well taken and well presented. There was time when we as a species existed more harmoniously with nature. Because we are Humans we have a power to influence and change our environments. When "we" were hunter-gatherer's our survival was linked to the natural cycles of nature. Today in the 21st that is just not so. "We" are the only species that can change our natures. If we look at our closest relative in the animal kingdom, even it cannot change its nature. Only "we" can overpopulate. Only "we" can artificially extend our lifespans. Only "we" can manipulate DNA. Our higher functions are exactly what has set us apart. "We" are a natural element of nature but many of the choices our higher brains make are not natural. Some of our choices are in direct opposition to our long-term survival. I do not believe that is "natural". I do not know what our place should be. I only know that if "we" destroy ourselves that it would not be natural it would be in direct contradiction to our natural instinct for self preservation. Yarak
Last Edit: Jan 16, 2007 15:21:32 GMT -5 by Master Yarak
If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away
Any action, including those that are counter to our survival, is natural. If the human race makes decisions that cause it's own extinction I see that as the perfect end to an imbalance caused by nature.
Think about storms, they exist until the imbalance which created them no longer exits and then they themselves calm down and vanish. In this way if the human race causes it's own extinction it could be looked at as a storm caused by evolution that eventually restored the balance of the planet.
Wow....this thread got DEEP!!!!.....As far as I am concerned, Humans are a virus on the planet and we will eventually consume the recources we need to survive. The world will go on and another species will evolve to rule for a short time.
Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines "Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day; give him a religion................ and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish."
lol, didnt this start out as me being stupid? then i got stupider and now it's about us humans. You know what i agree with knafu assuming his definition of NAtural is not like FATE this is the one of the definitons of Natural "existing in or produced by nature; not artificial or imitation;" we are NAture I agree with that we do things that are natural but when you say that anything we do is natural you cross the line between Fate and natural which i suppose you could mix up. but would be better if you didnt... if you say a nuclear explosion is natural which it isn't then it's more fate then a natural occurence.
"The harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph." -Thomas Paine
"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? -Marianne Williamson
Of course a nuclear explosion is natural....We as humans just harnessed the splitting of atoms to create a weapon. The term "we are our own worst enemy" best fits the bill. I do not beleive in fate or religeous cataclysmic predictions. We make a means to our own end. .....boy did this thread go of on a tangent??
Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines "Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day; give him a religion................ and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish."
Post by Master Yarak on Jan 17, 2007 0:22:39 GMT -5
Critical thinking..yummy. It seems the premise is that "We are natural, therefore all we do is natural" HA! WE do all kind of unnatural things. Artificial insemination, cloning, incest, preying on children, killing our own offspring, in vitro fertilization, altering DNA strands, putting people on life support etc. You think because we create technology that can do things we should not means its natural...hardly Yarak
If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away
Actually... incest and killing of own offspring are witnessed in many other species. I do agree though that just because WE are natural does not mean that what we DO is natural. There may or may not be an incorrect conclusion there, but either way it doesn't make sense.
Aurelia - General I ------------------------------------------- "It's not about the style of the flight; it's about the blood on the glove"
*FB EDIT* Please keep religon out of it, as it will just create a lot of arguments, thanks
I you think that since we are technically natural that every thing we do is natural then do that I see you point, however Natural is everything except US as a human race we used to do things that were natural, but our brain funtions throw us away from the rest of the world. we are a species who nothing can stop us from our own greed and selfishness. We are not natural because we are not in balance. we take far more than our share and leave the rest of the world scrambling to try to make up from our foolishness .Humans will bring about the end of this earth and nothing, nothing nature in a whole the wind and the water and the sun could ever stop the progresson of man we will fight it but nature restores it's balance and if tht means killing of the human race then so be it. however it also seems that we are the only ones who can save it, the sun will become a whitedwarf. if we fail to go to other star systems we and all life in this world are doomed. god this got deep... if every thing we do is natural then that IS your definiton we cannot say that the human race is natural and every thing we do is natural.We are out of balance and unstoppable we are the only thing on this planet who are not natural. we used to be a natural creature but nature broke it's laws and now we dominate.
Last Edit: Jan 17, 2007 14:32:08 GMT -5 by Falcon Boy
"The harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph." -Thomas Paine
"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? -Marianne Williamson
Yes Yarak I am saying that the atom bomb is a natural thing. Nature creates man. Man creates bomb. Nature creates bomb. Very simple, science is merely us using our intellect to do natural things that other species cant do. Just because we do something that is not repeated by a lower species does not make that action unnatural.
Higher brain function does not separate us from the apes period. We are a product of nature period. Our actions however scientific, horrific, and wonderful they my be are natural. The idea that our actions aren't natural stems from the ego of mankind and our desire to place ourselves above the natural order of things.
And also another thought that is a direct result of human bravado and vanity is the idea that we could destroy this planet. This planet will be around much longer than the human race will be and that's a fact. We can only hurt our own species and like I said before if we do wipe ourselves out that too will be natural.
P.S. Yarak, Keep pondering it you'll agree with it if you keep on digging
P.P.S. Sorry for the hijack of the thread but the original topic was beat to death anyway.